Mailbox: W-Z – 2: Nov. 1998 – present

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Paul Wilkinson

To: Paul Wilkinson
pwilkinson71ATonetel.net.uk
Manchester, England
Tue, 22 Jul 2003

Dear Paul,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'. I regret that we don't have any information on JND's library. It would certainly be of great interest to have some details.

• I'm copying this to my good friend Max Weremchuk, the JND biographer, in the hope that his ongoing research for his new biography of Mr. Darby may yield some of the information you desire.

There is no doubt that JND, even at a early age, valued his library. You may have seen the following:

• Never before had I seen a man so resolved that no word of the New Testament should be a dead letter to him. I once said; But do you really think that no part of the New Testament may have been temporary in its object? For instance – What should we have lost if St. Paul had never written, "The cloke that I left as Troas bring with thee, and the books, but especially the parchments …"? He answered with the greatest promptitude, "I should have lost something, for it was exactly that verse which alone saved me from selling my little library. No! every word, depend upon it, is from the Spirit, and is for eternal service".

• The above is an extract from Francis William Newman's 'Phases of Faith'. It appears on MB in Biography: J. N. Darby.

The balance of this letter is in Guests: My Stand 5: 'Christian' Zionism

I trust Max, or perhaps some other guest, may be able to assist you in your research. Please keep in touch and let us know of your progress.

In the Lord, Gordon.

Dear Friend,
In 2003, I began PhD research at Manchester University. My initial focus was to consider what was happening in the Church during the nineteenth century as the Jewish people began returning to their ancient homeland, and to identify those who were interpreting this momentous event in the light of Biblical prophecy. The title of my thesis was John Nelson Darby and the Origins of Christian Zionism (2006).

I have attached a flier which provides further information and an order form. Books can also be ordered from Paternoster via the telephone number or email address given on the form. I would like to pass on my author's discount to you if you order the book using the flier. Click Here to Download Flyer.

Please do not hesitate to contact me with any questions you might have.

Kind regards, Paul Wilkinson.
Assistant Pastor
Hazel Grove Full Gospel Church
Stockport, Cheshire

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William M. Willcox

To: William M. Willcox
wwillcoxATbellsouth.net
Palm Beach Gardens, Florida
Mon, 15 March 2004

Dear William,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'. We appreciate your confidence in asking the question:

• "My wife would like to know if she must be baptised to be considered a Christian".

The whole of this letter is in Guests: My Answer 4: Is Baptism Necessary?

Yours in the Lord, Gordon.

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Glen Willer

To: Glen Willer
glen1957ATtouch88.com.au
Perth, Australia
Fri, 17 Jan, 2003

Dear Glen,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'. We would be glad to know something of your background and what items on MB are of special interest to you.

In the Lord, Gordon.

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Derick R. Willetts

To: Derick R. Willetts
d-will-herATsupanet.com
Hereford, England
Wed, 7 Mar 2001

Dear Derick,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'! I hope you find it interesting.

Please feel free to share your experiences or exercises. Other guests are always interested, as I am.

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

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Ernest Williams
erniewATca.inter.net
Toronto, ON, Canada
Mon, 5 May, 2003

Dear Ernest,
Welcome to 'My Brethren' – good to hear from some one in my own hometown!

I would be glad to hear something about yourself, background etc., and what particularly interests you on MB.

In the Lord, Gordom.

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Richard Willoughby

From: Richard Willoughby
rwilloughbyATconknet.com
Bradford, NH, USA
Tue, 21 May 2002

I agree with the Darby translation of the Greek words ethnos, ethnç and ethnôn as nation(s) in Acts 9: 15, Galatians 2: 9, etc. Why don't more English translations get this right?

• I believe that by translating those Greek words correctly, Paul's apostleship should be seen as one in which he was sent out to the Jews of the Dispersion, rather than to Gentiles.

• That is, he was sent out by Jesus of Nazareth to the Jews of Greek speaking nations of Syria, Asia, Galatia, Macedonia and Achaia – synagogue to synagogue. Even at Rome he called the Jews, not Gentiles(e.g., Acts 9: 20; 13: 46, 28: 17; Romans 1: 16; 2: 9-10).

• Or, to say it another way, it was the other apostles, Peter, et al, who were to go to all the nations(panta ta ethnç, Matthew 28: 19.

• Any comment?

To: Richard Willoughby
Mon, 27 May, 2002

Dear Richard,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'. Yes, I do have some comments on your remarks.

The balance of this letter is in Guests: My Stand 4: Peter and Paul: The Spheres of their Commissions

Time available does not allow further exploration of this interesting matter, but I trust you will find the above of value in your considerations.

In the Lord, Gordon.

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Bob Wilson

Dear Bob,
Welcome to 'My brethren'! Sorry, at this time I'm not aware of any meetings of similar commitments in Utah.

I notice you live in North Dakota and wonder if your are planning to move to Utah. Please feel free to share your background and exercises.

In the Lord, Gordon.

From: Bob Wilson
Tue, 12 Feb 2002

Greetings. Thank you for writing, but we wish you had some better news regarding Utah. I am not sure what you mean by the word "exercises".

I am an ordained elder in the 'Grace Brethren Church' and presently attached to the 'American Missionary Fellowship' living in ND. I am not a pastor, but do about the same things. We do Bible studies and some preaching as the opportunity comes.

• We have a daughter and her family living in Utah where they attend a Calvary Chapel and have been interested in a 'brethren' style fellowship. They would like for us to move near them, but without some sort of "work" there is no way we can do that on our own. We have been asking the Lord for direction.

• I like the 'brethren' format for service and what would appear to be a conservative approach but have never been involved in a real 'brethren' group such as the PB. Our oldest son lives in the Detroit, Michigan,area and they attend an off-shoot of the PB and really like it.

• We, my wife and I, have been impressed when we have visited them, so we are interested in a change, etc. etc.

Nuf said at the moment I am sure. Bob Wilson.

To: Bob Wilson
Fri, 15 Feb 2002

Dear Bob,
Greetings! My name is Jeff Kuns and Gordon Rainbow, to whom I give general assistance on the MB website, referred your question to me.

• I hope you don't mind, but it seems that we have a few things in common!

• My family is from Whittier, California – most of them are still there, in fact. My wife and I both were raised in christian homes and our families attended the Grace Brethren denomination in Whittier.

• My Grandfather actually helped build the La Habra building and much of the Whittier building. Both my brother and my wife attended Grace College.

• When I was about 10 years old – 31 now – my dad, Steve, who was an Elder and longtime Sunday School teacher was hired as Associate and a few years later was elected Pastor.

• When my wife and I left Whittier – Southern CA – for Grass Valley – Northern CA – nine years ago we moved through three different churches with her side of the family over the course of six years and we finally settled at Calvary Chapel of Grass Valley for around three years.

• My attendance at Calvary Chapel ended early last year after a great deal of struggle, both inwardly and outwardly.

And not easily, but happily now, we have come away from the denominational systems which are characteristic of the ‘great house’ according to 2 Timothy 2: 19-22

• and now meet, Hebrews 10: 25, in our home with my brother-in-law and his wife.

• You might well be able to appreciate that a move like that, raised in ‘well churched’ families and having a father who is a clergyman, required very serious ‘exercises’ of conscience – this is what Gordon meant by that reference.

• But this is the manner in which those with ‘similar commitments’ meet; you will not be able to find a conference or formal organization, clergy, or even ordination; the meetings are usually found in various homes or rented halls all over the world.

This is not to say that sad failures and divisions have not marked even these separated brethren over the last 40-50 years – but

• that is to be expected when men fail to maintain things which God has been pleased to entrust to them according to the Holy Spirit and move by their own pride according to their own minds.

• We have come to judge, and that ourselves first of all, that every one whether in the ‘churches’ or out must bear the blame for these very public failures and in repentance leave them where they are as a matter of conscience.

Your oldest son more than likely attends what is known as an ‘open’ meeting if it is identified as having roots at Plymouth.

• No doubt you noticed the homepage of 'My Brethren' is subtitled “The history and ministry of those brethren commonly called ‘exclusive’ ”.

• While sharing common beginnings through the distinctive ministry of J. N. Darby and other early ministers of the truth, the ‘open’ and the ‘exclusive’ – or closed – meetings have very little in common today and in only the most superficial of ways.

• No doubt your son would have taken your questions already and been able to explain the way in which they met were he in a properly ‘exclusive’ meeting.

You may or may not be aware the Grace Brethren denomination and the so-called ‘Plymouth Brethren’ have literally nothing in common in historical terms.

• An outline of their various histories, which you may find interesting, can be found at
  Church of the Brethren Network.

Generally speaking, the Plymouth movement which began c. 1827 – the details of which I leave to you to pursue – was a distinct move of the Holy Spirit among the saints;

• Who raised up servants to Himself and recovered certain truths about the Church and what passes for it at present publicly, and the believers’ position in these final days before the Lord's return;

• truths, which bear heavily on faithfulness to the Lord and the right representation of God.

Martin Luther was used for recovery in a similar way, but was taken up with a different question, which is preliminary, and we could all agree, extremely important! That of the singular requirement of God's grace and salvation by faith in Jesus Christ “to whom be glory for ever. Amen”!

• However, Luther did not solve, nor did the Reformation, the various ecclesiastical doctrines that had sprung up since the first century,
  • such as sectarianism and clericalism, apostolic ‘succession’, set forms of worship, and various other organizational presumptions on Holy Scripture.

• As regards to this I would highly recommend a short essay On the Formation of Churches by J. N. Darby, which is among the wealth of ministry available on the website.

I hope, dear brother, you will forgive such a lengthy response but there is a great deal of misunderstanding, which I pray I have not added to in your mind, as regards the various ‘off-shoots’ of ‘Plymouth Brethren’ –

• from which we hope to remain aloof, judging that such things are against God's mind for the one body entirely, 1 Corinthians 1: 13.

I do hope that you will write again, to either Gordon or myself, and share further developments, which we would be very interested to hear.

Thanks again for bearing with such a long reply.

Yours in the Lord Jesus, Jeff Kuns.

To: Jeff Kuns
Fri, 15 Feb 2002

Dear Jeff,
Thank you for your comments – we have other things in our 'history'.

• We moved here, North Dakota, from Grass Valley, CA, and our daughter sometimes attended Calvary Chapel. I suggested they close the Grace Brethren Church there about 1984.

• Our daughter was a cook at Wolf Mountain Camp where she met her husband and later moved to San Diego but now live in Utah. It was in Utah that they came in contact with a 'brethren' group of some nature.

Yes I am aware there is no connection between the Grace Brethren and Plymouth – and I knew you would know that, of course, but it would help you to know where I was coming from.

• I have very little knowledge of the PB but have over the years had some contact with someone who knew someone who had a friend who – you get the picture.

• I don't understand some of the terms 'open' 'closed' just as I had never heard the word "exercises" used in that fashion.

The Grace Brethren church 'toyed' with a multi-eldership approach to church leadership some years back, but I have no idea what ever happened to it – guess it just passed away.

I really wish I had been more closely aware of the 'Brethren movement' a few years ago and I will be looking over the sites and materials you mentioned.

Thanks for writing. Hope to hear more from you.

Bob Wilson.

To: Bob Wilson
Sat, 16 Feb 2002

Dear Bob,

By the way, I am not entirely familiar with many 'terms' either, don't feel conspicuous! One would hope to avoid 'christianese' among the unsaved, and 'brethrenese' among brethren.

• I believe there is spiritual speaking – 1 Cor. 2: 13 – but it's unfortunate that nature can turn clannish with it! I hope we can avoid that!!

But I'm very sympathetic to your comment that you wish you could have been more aware of this movement in years past.

• I have often felt that "knowing the time, that it is already time that we should be aroused out of sleep for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed". It is encouraging to think of Jacob's feelings toward the end of his sojourn. Genesis 47: 9; 48: 15 :-)

• But I'm glad to hear you will be getting into the site, I hope you'll find as I do, that there is a wealth and vitality in the ministry of these servants.

Please do keep in touch!

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Jeff.

To: Bob Wilson
Sun, 17 Feb 2002

Hi Jeff,
There is more information on the 'web' than I have time to print, read and file, so due to other things that need my attention right now, I more than likely will not be a real chaser of addition information.

• What got me started looking at 'Brethren' sites is my son-in-laws interest. He had ask me some questions about "multi-eldership-church-groups" as he had fellowshipped for a while in some place in Utah, but he had lost track of them as he had moved so we were trying to find any more of the same group or whatever.

• When I begin to look, one site led to another one and in some cases, quite a bit of confusion and we have yet to find what we started out looking for.

Thanks for the details and for the fine letter. Bob Wilson.

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Dr. Wordsworth Wilson

From: Wordsworth Wilson
wordsworthwAThotmail.com
Cardiff, Wales
Sun, 27 Jun 2004

The following appeared on Steve Hesterman's web site: I am with 'exclusive brethren' in the UK linked with those who run the Kingston Bible Trust. I came into fellowship in 1979. Your account of events leaves me wondering why you are not in fellowship with our brethren in the Bronx, New York. Are you aware of them?

To: Wordsworth Wilson
Tue, 29 Jun 2004

Dear Wordworth,
I noticed your message on Steve Hesterman's site and thought you might be interested in visiting 'My Brethren' and signing the Guest Book.

I had a brotherly call from Ralph Gentles [of the Bronx] a few days ago, and we had dinner here with David and Eliza Crozier of Warrenpoint who were here to visit Eliza's brother.

• I'm also in occasional contact with Malcolm Withell at KBT, and Ian Purdy in Belfast.

Would you be the Dr. W. W. Wilson of Cardiff in the list of names in a recent KBT book?

In our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Wordsworth Wilson
Wed, 30 Jun 2004

Thanks. I am, as you have guessed, Dr Wordsworth Wilson in Cardiff.

• I am pleased to hear of your contacts with others of our group and I hope there is progress towards establishing fellowship.

• I would be glad to hear from you if there are any significant obstacles. I have been praying for recovery and seeing clearly that it must start with self judgement.

I was impressed with My Journey. I look forward to closer links.

To: Wordsworth Wilson
Mon, 5 Jul 2004

Dear Wordsworth,
Thanks for your brotherly reply. Yes indeed, recovery must always start with self judgment.

The re-establishing of 'fellowship' – as desirable as it may be – among those once together however is not as simple a matter as it might seem.

• There is always the matter of the original cause of separation.

• Then too, over time and as a result of experience, or further inquiry, varied viewpoints often emerge regarding matters once generally accepted.

• This results – in our case at least – in what some would regard as "significant obstacles".

I'm not sure that going into details would be helpful just now but suggest you look at some items on MB which may give some idea of our situation:

• My Stand 2: Aberdeen 1-5
• My Stand 3: Use of the Internet
• My Stand 3: Reconciliation of Brethren
• Studies: Our Responsibility in the Present State of the Church.
• There are numerous other related comments through out the 'Mailbox'.

But regardless of differences, great or small, our desire is to maintain good brotherly relations with all.

In our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Wordsworth Wilson
Sun, 22 Aug 2004

Hi Gordon,
It has taken me all this time to get around to reviewing some of the numerous articles to which you referred.

• It would take a long time to examine all in detail but so far I have not seen anything with which I fundamentally disagree re your stand.

• I wonder if it is possible for you to indicate specific 'issues' that would arise based on the discussions you have had previously with Ralph Gentles and David Crozier.

• I hope that is not too great an undertaking but feel free to say so if it is.

The Lord be with you.

To: Wordsworth Wilson
Mon, 30 Aug 2004

Dear Wordsworth,
Thanks for your reply and inquiry. Actually no 'issues' came up in my conversations with Ralph and David.

• Such 'issues' as there may be would arise from a somewhat different view of certain scriptures. I suspect that some with whom you walk would consider some differences as 'tests of fellowship'.

• While I do appreciate your sincere brotherly interest and concern, for me to name various 'issues' would probably lead to lengthy discussions which could not resolve anything at this time.

• Of course if you or any with whom you walk were close neighbours and there was the possibility, however remote, of practical fellowship, personal discussion of 'issues' might well be useful.

• I trust you can appreciate my concern, as I do yours. However, I would be glad to respond to any points on MB that you may wonder about.

In our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Wordsworth Wilson
Sun, 5 Sep 2004

Hi Gordon,
I was a little disappointed with your response but I understand your concern.

I am viewing things from the point of view that one seeks out those that are like minded bearing in mind that fellowship is ultimately universal.

• There are some who once had practical fellowship with us who have left on account of difficulties that do not bear upon 'fundamental truth' and have difficulty finding a suitable company. Many of these are in the US.

• There are other acquaintances who have some interest in the truth but are too far from the few locations where we have brethren in practical fellowship.

• It would be nice if one could feel free to reccomend your locality as a result of knowing where you stand.

• I know a lot is set out on your website but not many are sufficiently at ease with the internet or have the time to trawl through all the information there.

• It would therfore be of practial help if you could point out the areas that you are aware of where there is a difference between what you believe and what has been the position of our brethren with whom you have had some dialogue.

Please do not feel pressured to meet the request as I believe you must be very busy and may have many others to deal with that have higher priority but I hope you do find some time at your leisure.

I trust you will continue to enjoy God's blessing.

To: Wordsworth Wilson
Fri, 17 Sep 2004

Dear Wordsworth,
Thanks for understanding my concern but I am still reluctant to give you, or anyone, a list of points on which we may disagree with other brethren, believing this would only open an unprofitable discussion.

I appreciate your caution as to recommending persons you know to some you may know little about or as to whom you have doubts.

• We share this matter as we have inquiries from time to time.

• In these last and broken days it is difficult to find any of the groups arising out of the 1959 and 1970 crises which agree on every point.

• MB's policy is to refer inquirers to individuals known to us and in whom we have confidence as to their personal faithfulness and shepherd spirit, despite differences that may exist.

• Thus far the Lord has honoured our exercise.

In our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

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John Win

Dear John,

Thanks for visiting MB and for your very kind remarks. If you are free I would be interested to know something of your "involvement with the brethren movement in the past" – and to check out your "family site."

In our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: John Win
Tue, 18 Dec 2001

Hi Gordon,
Thanks for your reply, I really enjoyed your site and have been back several times.

My family has been in New Zealand since October 1842 and our involvement with the Brethren Movement came about through my Grandmother as her older sister became a member – Grandma was shunned in her 80's by the church.

My father and his four brothers were all brought up in the church until they all left at various stages of their lives. The last to leave was excommunicated and had to leave his family of 5 children behind. Looking back, I can only imagine what life was like for them when they left the church and struck out on thier own.

One of my cousins has left in recent years and it was a huge adjustment for her. Fortunatly, my uncle (her father) who was the last of his family to leave, was able to provide her with shelter and guidance so that today she is overseas and living a good life.

I was brought up in the Open Brethren here in New Zealand and married a woman from the fellowship my parents attended. I no longer attend a fellowship although I find I seem to be deeply spiritual.

The reason for my contact with you is that I am planning to build a website outlining the history of my family in New Zealand and I would like to include a link to this site purely as you have such a great information base of who was who and what is the Brethren Movement.

I find it interesting when reading the collection of books and ministry – about 500 items – that I have been left by various relatives. Some of the material in my posession dates back to first edition copies.

My wish concerning the website is purely to provide a suitably titled link to your site. I have no wish to make any kind of commentary or comment about the church myself as I prefer to leave that to those who know more about it. I do believe however that the subject is a very important part of our family history and I'm glad to have found your site and others like it to link to.

I hope for your favorable response

Yours, John D.Win.

To: John Win
Tue, 25 Dec 2001

Dear John,
Yes, you may show a link to 'My Brethren' using the information at the foot of this email. Please note that at some unknown time in the future the URL will change to mybrethren.ca – so check from time to time.

In our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

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Malcolm Withell

Very interested to come across this site, but took ages trying to find out how to make contact!

You may be interested to know that I am the manager at Kingston Bible Trust, and you can put any questions about stock, prices, content, etc., to me.

• Kingston Bible Trust [See 'The KBT Report'] has recently been republishing addresses which appeared in the Old Series of JT but which were excluded from the New Series.

• We are also considering reprinting some of GRC, AJG, AEM, etc.

To: Malcolm Withell
Thu, 01 Jul 1999

Dear Malcolm,
Welcome to 'My Brethren' – but I'm sorry it was difficult to find out how to make contact.

• The "Home Page" has directions to the Guest Book and Message forms, but you may have entered the site at another point.

• Provision for contact is only on the forms on 'Guests' page and 'Site News' to ensure full details of guests.

I haven't been able to find a web site for Kingston Bible Trust, and so am glad – and I am sure some guests will be also – to have an email contact for KBT.

• It appears to be your personal address, but I gather you won't mind if it is used to contact you regarding KBT.

• As time permits, I will add your email address to the references to KBT throughout the site.

I had noted the good news in the latest KBT catalogue that some addresses by others from JT Old Series were being reprinted.

• To learn now that reprinting some of GRC, AJG, AEM, etc., is being considered is further good news.

• While I greatly value the ministry of those who have led in the recovery,
  • for some time I have felt the lack of much helpful ministry by those you mention.

• Its publication will not only have a positive effect for edification but will help to dispel the notion, held by some, of a purely successional ministry.

One objective of 'My Brethren' – see 'Introduction' to the 'Ministry' group – is to provide a well rounded sampling of ministry,

• but especially of that by others than those whose books are in print and readily available.
• It is hoped that this will dispel misconceptions as to certain servants and their distinctive ministry, and also stimulate an interest in the ministry generally.

• You will, of course, discern that 'My Brethren' is not in competition with KBT in any sense – nor would I want it to be.

Your comments are appreciated. Please drop in again.

Yours in our Lord, Gordon.

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Harry Woodward-Clarke

From: Harry Woodward-Clarke
haxxaATstart.com.au
Sydney, NSW, Australia
Tue, 12 Dec 2000

The following message was on another site: G'day, while not ever having been part of any of the 'Brethren', I did have several school-mates who were 'PleB's (or is that 'PlyB's'?). In later years, I've become a Christian (of a primarily 'evangelical' persuasion) with an interest in Dispensationalism and its history - which tied in JND with my PB friends. I know a couple of the people I knew at school have left (one I found out today on this site). Please pardon my ignorance at the abuses hinted to in some of the messages. I ask God to richly bless you all in Jesus' Name, Harry.

To: Harry Woodward-Clarke
Wed, 13 Dec 2000

Dear Harry,
Since your message [above] indicates some interest in JND, you may also be interested in visiting 'My Brethren'.

Yours in the Lord Jesus, Gordon.

To: Harry Woodward-Clarke
Thu, 14 Dec 2000

Dear Harry,
Thanks for visiting MB. There's not much yet on your "interest in Dispensationalism and its history" but you might find Doctrine: The Lord's Coming a reading with J. B. Stoney, somewhat different from the popular overwhelming emphasis on the Rapture. Any comments?

While the author, Clarence Bass, rejects dispensationalism his 'Backgrounds to Dispensationalism' – Grand Rapids, 1977, Baker Book – is of considerable value.

• It is a fairly objective and thorough review of JND's teaching on dispensationalism and related matters.

I'm glad you could access the Menu-SiteMap with your work around. I tried it but still can't access it with Netscape. Thanks for the thoughts and I'll keep working on it.

Yours in the Lord Jesus, Gordon.

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Steve Wurth

To: Steve Wurth
wurthbooksATnetscape.net
Oswego, NY, USA
Thu, 7 Feb 2002

Dear Steve,
Thanks for visiting 'My Brethren'. Re your message regarding the 'Memorials of J. B. Catterall', will you confirm the price is $100.00, or should it be $10.00?

In our Lord, Gordon.

From: Steve Wurth
Thu, 07 Feb 2002

Hello, thanks for the note. One of our cataloguers listed this book this morning for $100.00. If there is any interest, please contact us.

Regards, Steve.

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Ken and Mary Wyllie

To: Ken and Mary Wyllie
akwATpost.queensu.ca
Kingston, Ontario, Canada
Re death of Charles Dunn – See "With Christ"
Sun, 23 Jan 2000

Dear Ken and Mary,
We were saddened indeed to hear of the loss of Charles to you and to his family. But the gain is his, to be with Christ. May our Lord comfort you all.

It was good to have him as a guest on 'My Brethren'.

You are often in our thoughts and we do not forget the many happy times with you and the children, your boundless hospitality, the grand debates and the sharing of exercises.

We miss you.

Affectionately in our Lord Jesus, Gordon and Betty.

From: Ken Wyllie
Sun, 23 Jan 2000

Dear Gordon and Betty:
Thank you so very much for your letter of comfort ... Charles was so dear to us and to our children … Mary used to keep in touch each weekend with Charles.

We are unsure of the burial date ... sometimes it takes quite some time as you know in the UK to collect distant relatives of Freda ... I think Mary will fly Tuesday.

How well we lovingly remember your visits, your care, and your hospitality .... and how well we should love to see you both again.

Again our love, Ken.

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Dick Wyman

To: Dick Wyman
dwymanATcloudnet.com
Sat., November 28, 1998

Dear Dick,
When I first visited your site and read the guest book – over a month ago – I was overwhelmed with grief at the sufferings of so many – and did not sign in.

Some of the persons are known and I am familiar with many names but – whether known or not – they are my brethren and I feel for them deeply. But more that this, I am sure that the Lord Jesus feels it all supremely, as he said to Saul, "I am Jesus whom thou persecutest".

I trust that the opportunity you have provided for contacts will help many in the continuing healing process.

Betty and I were often in Cleveland in the 1960's but I think you had left before our first visit. We were quite familiar with your family and have stayed with them and our names would be in the family guest book.

We withdrew in early 1971 – none too soon. After some fruitless time in the wilderness we re-committed ourselves to the Lord and to His interests. With a few others – mostly of other backgrounds – we meet for the Lord's Supper "until He come".

Yours in the Lord, Gordon Rainbow.

To: Dick Wyman
Subject: F. E. Raven, etc.
Sun., December 13, 1998

Dear Dick,
Checking our old photo albums, I found that Betty and I were in Cleveland in August 1962 at fellowship meetings with Dean Mills.

• One snapshot of a group of young people included none other than Dick Wyman. So it appears we had at least seen, if not met, you after all.

I can't locate it again but recall seeing a "wish list" of yours regarding biographies and reviews of ministry.

• I have recently completed a biographical sketch of FER which contains, I believe, quite a good deal of little known information.
  • I am not offering it to you as a contribution as it is an integral part of the 'My Brethren' site …

• There are also somewhat shorter bios of Mr. Coates and Mr. Cowell – which I hope to be able to expand …

Regarding FER, you show an extract from Mr. W. R. Dronsfield's 'The "Brethren" since 1870'.

• I first saw it in 1973 and have some notes as to what I consider to be misinterpretations which I may post in the future.

• Of course, it is always more difficult for an outsider – no matter how conscientious a historian he may be – to make an accurate and fair interpretation. I am conscious of my own need of help in this area.

While it is not the main purpose of 'My Brethren' I may in the future post, parts at least of, two interesting accounts which give a different perspective on the charges against FER and his ministry.

• One is Events in Ealing, a reasonably short account of the attempts by Mr. Raven's opponents to have Ealing break their links with Greenwich. One of the signatories is Mr. E. H. Chater.

• The other longer booklet – over 40 pages – is a
  Letter to the Saints by Mr. H. D'Arcy Champney. It details and deals with the whole range of opponents and their charges.
  • This account has peculiar weight because the author says as to one point, "for nearly two year I spoke against his teaching and believed him to be a very unsafe guide".

I mention the above because of the December 9th guest comments of Peter Rule, in your guest book, as to the "wicked system of Ravenism".

• The extract he gives from A. H. Rule – which I have known of for some years – is sadly typical of the extremes to which some still go in attributing Mr. Raven's ministry to Satan [the quotation follows]:
  • "We can easily see a tremendous power of Satan leading among many lines, such as Higher Criticism, Christian Scientists, Mormonism, Adventism, etc., etc., toward the apostasy seen in the 'vine of the earth', in Rev. 14.

  • "And these things are not merely local, but general, especially throughout protestant countries. One of these lines is Ravenism".

As a young man – around 1949 – I came up against that sort of thing.

• When I asked an older brother at a meeting I sometimes attended about those who met in – what I found out later was – the 'city room' of brethren I later met with, he said – among other things – 'We don't even know if they are Christians'.

• I went and saw and found that they were indeed Christians. I do not, of course, excuse the later developments which your site addresses.

Pardon me, I did not intend this to be so long and it is not intended as a contribution.

Yours in the Lord, Gordon.

From: Dick Wyman
Subject: Your FER biographical sketch

Hi Gordon,
Regarding FER, I read the article on your site with some interest.

• I have some material that I have long intended to work into my page on FER.

• Most of my information is anecdotal or from a biography of his grandson.

I thought of linking to your site and have actually done so.

• The menus across the top of each page include a 'PB Roots' item and I've placed a link to your 'My Brethren' site at the top of that list.

• If anyone inquires for more info on FER, I'll send them your way.

Dick.

To: Dick Wyman
Subject: Date of London Central Hall Photo
Sun, 03 Jan 1999

Dear Dick,
Regarding whether the year is 1958 or 1959.

SMcC took the 1958 meetings but does not appear in the photo. He was not at the 1959 meetings according to initials in book. He would undoubtedly have been on the first row at either of the meetings.

JTJr was not at the 1958 meetings according to initials in book and info from a former New York brother, but appears in the photo.

Based on the above the photo would definitely be 1959. I hope this helps.

Gordon.

To: Dick Wyman
Subject: Robert Thomson's entry in your Guest Book
Fri, 12 Feb 1999

Hi Dick,
Just dropped in to see how your site was progressing and I noticed the message from Robert Thomson of Glasgow on February 3, 1999.

• How refreshing that he is not ready to put all the blame for recent unhappy history on JND, as some seem ready to do.

• Some years ago I tried to fix the blame on those who had gone before. But I had to come to the judgment that attempting to do so was an indication of my spiritual immaturity.

Daniel was a young man at the time and was not personally to blame for Israel's captivity in Babylon.

• When an old man, after reading the prophet Jeremiah, he confesses, "Ah Lord ... we have sinned ..."

• He humbles himself for the sins of his people and takes responsibility for the failure and departure from God. He does not say "they" sinned, but continually says "we". See Daniel 9.

• O for such a spirit in our day. Let us each take this place before God. Will He not hear? "Lord, hear! Lord, forgive! Lord hearken and do! defer not, for Thine own sake, O my God! for Thy city and Thy people are called by Thy name".

Please send this message on to Robert Thomson. I would like to hear from him.Thank you.

Yours in the Lord, Gordon.

To: Dick Wyman
Subject: Guest Book Registration - Robert Thomson
Fri, 12 Feb 1999

Hi Gordon,
You're not the first to want to contact Robert Thomson. Unfortunately, he didn't provide an email address. I checked an online directory and found about 40 Robert Thomsons in Glasgow. I checked with Alistair Deayton, of Paisley, and he had never heard of him.

Dick.

To: Dick Wyman
Subject: For your Guest Book
Mon, 19 Jul 1999

Hi Dick,
Thanks to John McKillop, whose email address is in your Guest Book, we were able to make contact with our niece Phyllis Schaumburg Bedard, formerly of Chicago who now lives in Tennessee.

Phyllis, and ourselves, would be glad of any news of:

• her mother, Betty's sister. Mary Schaumburg who is still 'in';
• Phyllis' brother Colin who is 'out' but not heard from in many years;
• also, Elaine Daley of Galt-Cambridge, Ontario.

Phyllis is not on the net but we will forward any messages to her.

Of course, any of your guests will be welcome on 'My Brethren'.

Many thanks, Yours in our Lord,
Gordon and Betty Rainbow.

To: Dick Wyman
Wed, 29 Oct 2003

Dear Dick,
I just saw the notice of the imminent closing of your web site which I have monitored regularly over the past few years.

• Perhaps I realize, better than many, the amount of time and energy you have expended to maintain such a large and active web site. Certainly, your reasons for closing are understandable.

• I was faced with the same situation for 'My Brethren' – opened 5 years ago – because of advancing age and declining energy, but the Lord graciously provided Jeff Kuns to continue the work.

While, as you may suspect, I have concerns as to the nature of some of the articles and correspondence on your site,

• I want to take this opportunity to express my appreciation for the extremely valuable service you have rendered in providing a means for many – including myself – to make new contacts and renew old links with family and friends

• – and for your personal commitment over a long period.

I hope the relief from the reponsibilty for the site reduces your stress level significantly and results in an improvement in your health.

Doubtless many will miss your site but, while 'My Brethren' serves a quite different purpose, I hope you will post this in your guest book as an invitation to any who may be interested to visit 'My Brethren'.

May the Lord richly bless you and your family, Gordon.

Perhaps not surprisingly, the above email does not appear in Dick's Guest Book along with many similar messages.

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Frankie Cheong Yee

From: Frankie Cheong Yee aka "SyeeC"
syeecATsingnet.com.sg
Singapore
Wed, 6 Oct 1999

Hi Gordon,
Thank you for your site. Have added a link from mine to yours.

By His grace, Frankie.

To: Frankie Cheong Yee
Fri, 08 Oct 1999

Hi Frankie,
Thanks for visiting 'My Brethren' and listing it in your links. If it's not too much trouble could you show the name as

My Brethren (Gordon Rainbow)

Also, while it is a personal home page, you might find it more appropriate to show it under 'Others' Views on Assemblies' but that, of course, is your decision.

I am adding a link to your 'Links to Assembly related Sites' on my 'Site News'.

I'll be glad to hear from you anytime.

Yours in the Lord, Gordon.

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M. Yesuratnam

To: M. Yesuratnam
myrt_mercyATrediffmail.com
N.T.R. Colony, Guntur, India
Thu, 21 Mar 2002

Dear M. Yesuratnam,
Thank you for visiting 'My Brethren' and for the detailed account of your work which has been read with interest.

• However, I trust you will understand that neither the available space or our site objectives allow your email to be published on MB.

• Our commitment to the history and ministry of those brethren commonly called 'exclusive' – and their conscientious refusal to accept help from those of other convictions – precludes the public solicitation of financial support for our own needs, much less for others based on differing principles.

• Our confidence in the Lord is, that if He desires a work to be done He will surely supply whatever is needed from His own resources.

In the Lord, Gordon.

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Kyle Yoakum

To: Kyle Yoakum
yoakumATix.netcom.com
Mesquite, TX, USA
Mon, 21 May 2001

Dear Kyle,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'. I'm glad you found it informative and trust that you will continue to do so.

CAC is generally well known by his books but very few know anything of his personal life and commitments.

• As you suggest, the biography of CAC will prove interesting as, I'm sure other biographies and ministry should also.

I'll be glad to hear from you again, both as to items of interest on MB and any exercise or experiences you care to share with other guests.

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Kyle Yoakum
Mon, 21 May 2001

Dear Gordon,
Thanks for the good response. I called Larry Wolf of Dover Bible Fund last night and ordered the missing volumes I needed of J. B. Stoney.

• I have all of CAC's works but discovered there are now volumes 32 and 33, so ordered those as well. As of yet, I have never read much of Raven.

• I mentioned your web sight to Larry. He hadn't heard of it. I told him I would send copies of the CAC, JBS, and Raven since I printed those out for myself. He was quite interested.

• Today I read your account of CAC with much interest. He is one of my favorites.

I greatly appreciate all the hard work the Lord you have done in the web site. It is very encouraging.

• I am on Roy Huebner's mailing list and have been grieved at his comments on Coates.

• I have yet to read anything by dear CAC that has caused any alarm in me.

Yours in Christ, Kyle Yoakum.

To: Kyle Yoakum
Wed, 23 May 2001

Dear Kyle,
Thanks for your reply. I have heard of Larry Wolf and the Dover Bible Fund, but have had no contact with him. Perhaps your sending of several items to him will prompt a visit to MB.

Regarding ministry by JBS, you may not be aware but there is a CD in preparation. See Guests: Site News: The KBT Report: Ministry on CD-ROM.

I'm glad you liked the biography of CAC. My only regret as to it is that there is not more information available. Your appreciation of MB is certainly an encouragement.

You mention that you have not read much of Mr. Raven's ministry. If interested check Guests: Site News: Zip Files for some files that are available.

I'm aware of Roy Huebner's publications and share your grief at the comments as to CAC.

• He and others seem obsessed in their opposition to, and blinded to appreciating, the truths that have come out in the ministry of FER, JT, CAC and others.

• Sadly, he is among "those who refused spiritual ministry as heresy and linger on in a fossilized traditionalism".

Your letters have been refreshing, Kyle, and I hope to hear further from – and about – you as opportunity affords. Don't hesitate to contact me.

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Kyle Yoakum
Wed, 23 May 2001

Gordon,
Thanks for the good reply. I am reading the JBS bio and am being so refreshed. His last days papers are truly edifying.

Concerning the cd, I use a Mac, so am unable to make use of them.

Yours, Kyle.

From: Kyle Yoakum
Thu, 24 May 2001

I just finished reading your biographical sketch of J. B. Stoney. The long account of 'Closing Days' is quite touching.

• At the beginning of his illness, Stoney comments,
  "The only trial I have is that illness makes me so self-occupied instead of thinking of the Lord".

• However, as I read the recorded accounts written by his daughter, I am amazed at how much this dear brother was occupied with Christ alone.

• He commented, "How much I have lost by occupation with myself, and present things, and how much I now enjoy having only to do with eternal things".

• His comments have challenged me to spend more time with the Lord and allow Him to be my heart's occupation. All work, etc., for Him comes out of such a sweet abiding.

The Lord spoke to brother Stoney's daughter very soon before He took him and seemed to say, "He is Mine!"

• She realized how dear he was to the Lord and how much He loved her father.

• May we be such saints who grow to know the Lord not only in truth but also in an intimate way.

I thank you for making these precious accounts available. They are not only encouraging me,

• but I am passing on the encouragement to other saints. These dear brethren from the past are still bearing fruit.

On a side note, I also enjoyed the account of C. A. Coates.

• I didn't realize how limited he was in serving the Lord because of his ill health, but he accepted this from the Lord's hand and didn't complain.

• As a result, his written ministry still ministers to the seeking believers.

• I remember one of his favorite words is appreciation. He learned to appreciate Christ with all his heart. May we follow in his steps.

To: Kyle Yoakum
Fri, 25 May 2001

Dear Kyle,
Thanks for your 2 letters of Thu, 24 May 2001.

1. Your appreciation of the biographies of JBS and CAC is confirming and encouraging. I hope that your com-ments will stimulate other guests to read them as well.

2. Your question as to "one leader" is timely and important. I'm glad you have raised the matter. But just now I have a little backlog, and ask your patience for a week or so before I can answer.

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Kyle Yoakum
Thu, 24 May 2001

Dear Gordon,
I like your article on objective and subjective truth. It is quite balanced.

Perhaps you can help me with an issue. When I was in the Local Church, Witness Lee, group, 1975-1989, I often heard that God used one man at a time for His move on earth …

The balance of Kyle's letter is in Guests: My Answer 3: One Leader.

Your thoughts? Kyle Y.

To: Kyle Yoakum
Thu, 07 Jun 2001

Dear Kyle,
There is a mixture of fact and error in Witness Lee's teaching "that God used one man at a time for His move on earth" …

The balance of my reply is in Guests: My Answer 3: One Leader.

I hope this answers your question sufficiently. Please don't hesitate to ask if anything seems unclear and, of course, I look forward to hearing from you again.

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Kyle Yoakum
Sat, 09 Jun 2001

Gordon,
I wrote the following a couple of years ago. You may find it of some interest. Kyle.

"I was under Witness Lee's ministry from 1975 to 1989. For thirteen of those years I lived in So California and was actually present for W Lee's ministry".

• [In response to a message from some one else, Kyle commented on the "positives" and "weaknesses" of WL's ministry.]

To: Kyle Yoakum
Tue, 26 Jun 2001

Dear Kyle,
I have finally been able to give the time it deserves to your review of Witness Lee's ministry. Thank you for sending it.

• I appreciate your thoughtful, balanced and full examination of your subject. Most persons who leave a group can only speak negatively.

• Your comments are particularly valuable to me as they come from one who had been an 'insider' and who can speak from intimate personal knowledge.

• I value this especially as I have seen many remarks by outsiders – some brief and some extensive – on the history and ministry of the brethren featured on MB.

• Many presume to know and understand various situations but are both unqualified and unable to do justice to the subject.

Thanks again very much for sharing your comments. Whether they should at some time be posted on MB is something I will have to consider.

Yours in the Lord Jesus, Gordon.

From: Kyle Yoakum
Mon, 17 Jul 2006

Dear Gordon and Jeff,
You have a wonderful web site, so resourceful.

I asked the following question another forum. You may have some insight into the idea of the church being under one man.

There is a new book published by Paternoster titled "Searching For the True Church", by Roger Shuff. The book is quite vast and covers many topics, mostly around 'Brethren', both 'open' and 'exclusive', in the 20th century. It's a very interesting read.

One thing Shuff says at the end of the book is there needs to be more scholarly investigation into how "Watchman Nee, as an intermediary through whom aspects of the thinking on connexial Brethren's James Taylor, Sr. may have been transmitted to Restorationism. The affinity between Nee's spirituality and that of Brethren has been recognized. (See Walker--Restoring the Kingdom, p. 235, David Lillie - Beyond Charism, pp. 49-50.)"

The balance of Kyle's letter and my reply is in Guests: My Answer 3: One Leader.

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Gene Zigler

Gene Zigler
lifechangeATprodigy.net
Phoenix, AZ, USA
Sat, 14 Apr 2001

Dear Gene,
Welcome to 'My Brethren'! You are right. The 'FER' whose book you have is indeed the F. E. Raven whose biography is on MB. Biography: F. E. Raven.

• It always helps to know something personally of a servant as Paul expressed in 2 Timothy 3: 10-11.

• The 'Notes of Lectures' have been reprinted in 20 volumes as 'Ministry by F. E. Raven'. See Guests: Site News: Bibles and Books: Kingston Bible Trust.

• The items in your book are now included in Volume 2 of the 'New Series'.

I'm glad you enjoyed the book. For your further interest I'm attaching 2 zip files of his ministry, plus pkunzip. I'll be interested to know how you get on.

Besides Ministry: FER, the MB Ministry group also includes articles by a number of FER's contemporaries and who were in practical fellowship together.

Thanks for visiting MB. Come again and please feel free to share your background and exercises as many other guests have done in the 'Mailbox'.

Yours in our Lord Jesus, Gordon.

Your guest entries and messages will show that the continuation of My Brethren is important to you.

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