The consideration of Christ, as presented in these chapters, will involve seeking help on travail, as seen in the woman, with a view to the male son being brought forth;

• and also on the marriage of the Lamb, because those who form the wife constitute the armies.

• We should notice that the setting of both scriptures is one of conflict and warfare, the Lord being finally seen as the great Warrior.

• The bringing forth of the male son is in a setting of conflict; then there is war in heaven; and then a retrospective view of the present conflict in the celebration in heaven –
  • “they have overcome him”, it says, “by reason of the blood of the Lamb, and by reason of the word of their testimony, and have not loved their life even unto death”, Revelation 12: 11.

• It will no doubt apply to others after we have gone, but it is also a retrospective view of the conflict of our dispensation, which has its own character.

• Then in chapter 19 the warfare is brought to finality. It says in verse 20, as to the beast and the false prophet,
  • “Alive were both cast into the lake of fire which burns with brimstone”.

Ques. Do you think, going back to chapters 1 and 4, that the voice as of a trumpet – Revelation 1: 10 and 4: 1 – has in mind the assembling of all that is faithful to God in relation to this conflict?

• Is there not somewhat a militant idea in the voice as of a trumpet, as an assembling note for every faithful believer?

G.R.C. So that, while the voice was heard by the bondman, John, you would think that that trumpet voice should sound in the hearts of all the bondmen?

Rem. I would think that in being passed on by John it does not lose that character. It reaches the saints in the character in which he heard it.

G.R.C. So you think it gives character to the book, as mobilising the bondmen for the conflict?

Rem. That was what I wondered.

Ques. Does John in this book justify the name given to him and his brother by the Lord – Boanerges, meaning

• “Sons of thunder”, Mark 3: 17?

• Is thunder like heaven asserting its rights to the earth?

G.R.C. Yes. It is remarkable that the one thing which he was not to write was the voice of the seven thunders. Revelation 10: 4. Why do you think that was?

Ques. Is there not something inscrutable in all God’s ways?

Ques. Does the prominence of heaven connect at all with Deborah’s song –

• “From heaven was the fight”, Judges 5: 20?

G.R.C. Quite so. Our passage begins,

• “A great sign was seen in the heaven”.

• We have heaven’s view of the vessel of testimony, the woman, primarily referring to Israel according to God’s mind. What thoughts He has as to Israel! –
  • “a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars”.

• But then she is viewed as being with child, and in travail, and in pain to bring forth, because the great thing in view is the male Son.

• The woman is portrayed in her glory and dignity according to God’s mind and purpose – not according to the actual state of Israel, of course; but then our attention is focussed upon the Child.

Ques. What is the force of the expression, “a male son”?

G.R.C. Does it not stress the necessity for what is suggested in the male? The Old Testament speaks of the males, both in the offerings and in those who appeared before God.

• It was not that the women did not go up to the feasts, as we know, but the stress was upon the fact that all the males were to go up.
  • Sonship is also stressed – a male Son.

• I think the point is the One who is suited to be caught up to God and to His throne.

• That is, what is in mind is the Priest and the King. It is the Son who is the Priest, as it says in Hebrews 7: 28,
  • “A Son perfected for ever”.

• But the stress here is on the official glory of Christ – His worthiness to fill out the office of Priest and King.

Ques. Is that why Zechariah is privileged to bring that combination forward in history when the remnant was at a low ebb publicly?

G.R.C. Do you mean where he speaks of him being a priest upon his throne Zechariah 6: 13?

Ques. Yes. Do you think that the prophetic side of the matter is one thing, but the travailing to bring forth is quite another?

G.R.C. “Caught up to God” is the priest, “and to his throne” is the king;

• and it is those features, I believe, which the Spirit of God would exercise us about.

• As we know, while the male Son primarily is Christ, it includes the saints of this dispensation. This is the nearest reference to the rapture in this book.
  • “Her child was caught up to God and to his throne”, verse 5,

• and in that catching up we have to think not only of Christ going up, but of all who are His – those whom Paul would speak of as His body.

Ques. Would the fact that the saints of this dispensation are included be confirmed by the word to Thyatira, where it says of him that overcomes,

• “To him will I give authority over the nations, and he shall shepherd them with an iron rod”, Revelation 2: 26-27?

G.R.C. The overcomer is to shepherd the nations with an iron rod. As you say, it confirms that the saints are associated with Christ in this matter.

Ques. Is the figure of travail used to emphasize what is actually being formed in the saints at the present time – as to their understanding of the place that Christ has, and is to occupy?

• Later the remnant of Israel will begin to see that the One they rejected is the One who belongs to heaven, and has taken His rightful place; and it will affect their testimony.

G.R.C. The travailing to bring forth is a very important matter. While the woman represents Israel,

• the travail is continued throughout our dispensation in the assembly as the Israel of God – the Jerusalem above, according to Galatians.

• Paul travailed again in birth that Christ might be formed in them, Galatians 4: 19, and this travail is to go on with a view to the male son being formed in the saints.

• We see the idea perfectly set out in Christ, but there is to be formation by the Spirit in the saints which gives them ability to be fully for God,
  • at the present time in the testimony, and in the future time in the public position – to be fully for God in priestly and royal dignity.

Rem. So that there is something definitely arrived at.

Ques. Would this be parallel with John 16?

• “Again a little while and ye shall see me”, verse 16;

• and then in verse 21 you get the thought that a woman, when she gives birth to a child,
  • “has grief because her hour has come; but when the child is born, she no longer remembers the trouble, on account of the joy that a man has been born into the world”.

• Then the chapter finishes with,
  • “In the world ye have tribulation; but be of good courage: I have overcome the world”, verse 33.

G.R.C. That is a good scripture to bring forward. That time was the time of travail for the disciples; and, if there is to be any formation of Christ in us, it involves travail. He says,

• “Again … ye shall see me”.

• They were to know Christ after the flesh no more, and that involved travail.

• They were to apprehend Him as a Man born into the world, and that is God’s world.

• We see Him risen and ascended as the Centre of God’s world – the Firstborn from the dead. He is referred to in this book as,
  • “the firstborn from the dead” Revelation 1: 5

• – a Man born into the world.

• The Man who is the Centre of God’s world has been caught up to God and to His throne.

• The first thing is to apprehend Christ in that character; and then, as we take up the exercise, it will lead to formation in our souls.

Ques. Why is it, “her child” here?

G.R.C. It gives credit to the woman and her exercises. It would stress that this cannot be brought about without pain and travail on the part of the woman. So God says it is her child.

Ques. I suppose travail involves hard work and suffering. Is that because it means the displacement of the first man inwardly, in order that what is of Christ might come into full expression?

G.R.C. I think so. John 16 involves that even Christ after the flesh is known no more, and that is a solemn thing to face. Everything connected with man after the flesh is superseded.

Ques. Would it be not only the sinful side of things but the natural order?

G.R.C. Exactly, because with Christ after the flesh there was no sin; but even Christ after the flesh we know no more.

• The acceptance of this involves travail. It involves the death lesson really – to pass over in our spirits into God’s world; so that a Man is born into the world in our apprehension.

• The male Son is there as viewed in Christ; but then the saints are to be brought into accord with Him, so that
  • all who belong to God’s world – Christ and all who are of Him – are translated to heaven.

Ques. Do we learn to move from Benoni to Benjamin in that way? It went hard with Rachel; there was deep suffering, but she was encouraged; and out of all that came Benjamin, the son of the right hand.

G.R.C. That is very good. The Lord says in John 16,

• “ye will be grieved”,

• but then the result is that we apprehend Christ as the Centre of God’s world.

Rem. Travail in Romans 8 is linked with the creation, although we also are said to groan.

• But when the Lord applies the principle in John 16, he says, “Ye …”.

• From the Romans 8 viewpoint, the idea is in our hearts, and we are waiting conformity to it in sonship.

• But, in John 16, with the absence of the Lord imminently before the disciples, it was a matter of grief;
  • but He was showing them that, with the incoming of the Spirit, they would have joy in relation to Himself as the Man born into the world.

G.R.C. I think so. And so when it comes to the saints travailing, the idea of the woman enters into it, and it is in a setting of great danger.

• The dragon stood before the woman, in order that when she brought forth he might devour her child. All is in the presence of the greatest opposition.

Ques. Travail has the thought of propagating love’s ideal, has it not?

G.R.C. Exactly.

Ques. In Psalm 2, Jehovah says,

• “I have anointed my king – Thou art my Son; I this day have begotten thee”, Psalm 2: 6-7.

• It is in answer to the tumultuous raging of the nations. Ought we to be concerned as to the nations, and the need for a male son in connection with what is going on in the earth?

G.R.C. I think that is the bearing of this chapter. It is a question of the Priest and King, and of the saints functioning as a royal priesthood, as formed after Christ;

• so that we are able to stand here, in royal dignity, and priestly feeling, maintaining the rights of God in testimony, before the highest authorities if necessary.

• The final thing is, as we noticed, that the child shall shepherd all the nations with an iron rod; and the promise to Thyatira shows our part in that.

• We are soon to have a part in dealing thus with the nations as a whole.

• But the present thing is that we bear testimony. So it says in verse 11, referring retrospectively to the present time,
  • “They have overcome him by reason of the blood of the Lamb, and by reason of the word of their testimony”.

• Now that requires the royal priesthood at the present time. It is the royal priesthood who are qualified to wield the sword of the Spirit – the word of their testimony.

Ques. It says, “Upon her head a crown of twelve stars”.

• Is her travailing in relation to the rights of Christ as represented in the twelve stars?

G.R.C. She is “clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars”,

• so that she is concerned that the complete rights of Christ – every feature of His authority – might be held here inviolate in testimony.

Ques. Supreme authority in the sun, and delegated authority in the moon – what is vested in the assembly, do you think?

G.R.C. Quite so. And upon her head a crown of twelve stars. The dragon has ten horns. He never reaches the number twelve;

• but in divine administration the number twelve is complete.

Ques. What about the four dimensions in Ephesians 3? Is there a suggestion of travail with Paul as he bows his knees to the Father in relation to the saints?

G.R.C. He was in very deep exercise, was he not?

• One has been thinking of that passage in regard to these readings, desiring that the Father would come into the matter which we are engaged with.

• The Father would strengthen us, according to the riches of His glory, with might in the inner man,
  • “that the Christ may dwell, through faith, in your hearts”, Ephesians 3: 16-17.

• It is the Father’s desire and purpose that the assembly should apprehend Christ, and hold Him in her heart in every feature of His glory.

Rem. It says, “That ye may be fully able to apprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and depth and height; and to know the love of the Christ which surpasses knowledge”, Ephesians 3: 18-19.

G.R.C. And the love of the Christ runs through this book, does it not?

• “To him who loves us”, it begins; and the final word is, “I Jesus”, Revelation 1: 5; 22: 16.

• The Person we have been considering, so infinitely great and glorious, comes to us and says, “I Jesus”. It is love which surpasses knowledge!

Ques. The challenge is met on earth by the male Son being born on the earth;

• but then He is caught up to heaven, remains in heaven for a while;

• and then, in chapter 19, He comes forth to deal with things on the earth again.

• Then the saints are formed on the earth, taken up to heaven at the rapture, and come out to deal with the earth again.

• What is the reason for these moves, first on earth, then in heaven, and then on the earth again?

G.R.C. Would not the time of travail and formation and bringing forth be while the saints are on earth?

• Then, as you say, we are caught up to heaven; certain adjustments take place; the marriage of the Lamb takes place; and then we come forth with Him as the armies.

• But now is the time for formation.

Ques. Would the thought be that everything must be maintained testimonially in suffering grace here, the ground thus held for the coming Heir until we come forth with Him in glory?

• It is the same vessel which has maintained His rights as absent, is it not?

G.R.C. Quite so. So she is the bride, the Lamb’s wife. Those who form that vessel have overcome in their period of conflict

• by reason of the blood of the Lamb, and by reason of the word of their testimony, and have not loved their life unto death.

• There is the present conflict of its own peculiar nature; then, as you say, the saints are caught up out of the sphere of conflict,
  • and then the conflict is handed to others, and takes on a different character, because the dragon is cast down to earth.

• But the peculiar nature of our conflict is while the dragon is still in heaven, and he is there as the accuser of the brethren. In verse 9 he is given his full name –
  • “the great dragon … the ancient serpent, he who is called Devil and Satan, he who deceives”

• – but he is cast out; and in verse 10 it says,
  • “the accuser of our brethren has been cast out, who accused them before our God day and night”.

• So it is a day and night matter; the anti-priest is there accusing the brethren day and night; and we are to maintain continuous intercession.
  • We are never to be among the accusers of the brethren – we are on the enemy’s side if we are – and we are to be here in priestly intercession and in royal ability to sustain the testimony.

Ques. Would you say that his manifest exposure comes before all in verse 9 of chapter 12, in his true character publicly; but we are not ignorant of his devices?

• Is he morally discerned in his movements by those who thus travail?

G.R.C. So that whether as the serpent, or as the Devil, or as Satan, or as the deceiver, we are not ignorant of his devices.

Ques. Paul calls him by different names, does he not?

G.R.C. Quite so. He says,

• as the serpent deceived Eve by his craft”, 2 Corinthians 11: 3.

• The word “Devil” means accuser; that would link with verse 10,
  • “the accuser of our brethren”;

• and the word Satan means the adversary.

Ques. Is it remarkable, in the reference which Paul makes to the serpent, and in the original allusion to him, that the travailing sex is before us, and the thought of the serpent is first in this description?

• But is not Satan more connected in scripture with being peculiarly adverse to sonship; and that is the last description of him here.

G.R.C. And as the Dragon, which is another view, he would devour the male son.

Rem. In Job 2 the sons of God presented themselves, and then Satan presented himself before Jehovah in opposition.

G.R.C. Quite so. And it is clear that the work of the serpent in Genesis resulted in the need of travail.

• The serpent having done his work, if there is to be anything for God henceforth, it can only be through travail.

• But now, in chapter 19, we should touch briefly on the marriage of the Lamb.

• Our objective is the Lord coming out later in the chapter; but I thought the marriage of the Lamb would bear on a question raised yesterday afternoon,
  • as to whether the character of praise set out in chapter 5 should enter into our service in the morning meeting. I think it should.

• We may not use the title “The Lamb”. We are free to do so, of course, but it is a symbolic title of the Lord, and we would normally call Him Lord Jesus.

• But I believe in connection with the cup –
  • “This cup is the new covenant in my blood”, Luke 22: 20

• – there is room for a very fervent vocal response to Christ as the One who has redeemed to God by His blood out of every tribe and tongue and kindred and nation.

• The scope of redemption should be before us; not simply how it affects us, but how it affects God – that He has redeemed to God by His blood.

• The whole scope of the matter would lead us to prostration before Him.

Rem. “Redemption’s glory shed”, the hymn says.

G.R.C. And this passage shows how the wifely side would closely link with that; for the word is,

• “Let us rejoice and exult, and give him glory; for the marriage of the Lamb is come”.

• This, of course, refers to the public celebration of the marriage after the church is translated, but then Paul’s doctrine shows that the union of Christ and the church is to be entered into also at the present time.

• It is in mystery at present. It is not a mystery in Revelation 19, when the marriage is celebrated; but there is the mystery of Christ and the assembly now –
  • “Because of this a man shall leave his father and mother, and shall be united to his wife … This mystery is great”, Ephesians
    5: 31-32.

• At the present time the union of Christ and the assembly is in mystery; but I am thinking of the moral link between this and chapter 5.

• Surely, if the Lamb has His place, and we are led into a state of prostration of soul before Him, as we think of the vastness of the scope of what He has effected at such a cost, it is only a short step to wifely relations.

Rem. We really approach the Supper from the suffering angle, because it is deposited in the assembly in the scene of treachery –

• “In the night in which he was delivered up”, 1 Corinthians 11: 23.

G.R.C. So the word is,

• “I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb’s wife”, Revelation 21: 9;

• and here, “the marriage of the Lamb is come”.

• How we rejoice to think that He has a wife! How worthy He is to have a wife!

Ques. Does the marriage of the Lamb involve the presentation of the assembly to Christ?

G.R.C. I think it would coincide with that –

• “that he might present the assembly to himself”, Ephesians 5 :27,

• although each scripture has its own setting, so that the view here is somewhat different. It says here,
  • “His wife has made herself ready”;

• it is not the Lord’s service, as in Ephesians 5, but His wife has made herself ready; and then there is what is given to her, as though God comes into the matter.
  • “It was given to her that she should be clothed in fine linen, bright and pure; for the fine linen is the righteousnesses of the saints”.

• It is a most important thing, even in human affairs, that a wife, who is to be the wife of a very highly-placed man, should be in every way suited to the position; she would need to be concerned about it, as to being ready.

• And, if we see the way the Lord presents Himself in the book of Revelation, the glory and majesty in which He is presented, what a concern there should be!

Ques. Would there be some idea of it in the book of Esther, where it speaks of six months with oil of myrrh, and six months with spices? Esther 2: 12.

G.R.C. That is a majestic setting also. Each scripture, of course, has its own setting.

Ques. Would you say a word as to what was granted her? Is that something additional to making herself ready?

G.R.C. The two things seem to be blended, do they not? She has made herself ready; but then what was granted to her was,

• “that she should be clothed in fine linen, bright and pure; for the fine linen is the righteousnesses of the saints”.

• So that, on the one hand it is the result of the exercises of the saints and their righteousnesses, but then it is given to her to be clothed in it.

Ques. Does not Genesis 24 bear on this? Rebecca took what was given to her; and then finally she took the veil, and covered herself.

G.R.C. Each scripture has its own setting; and there it is largely what the servant did.

• That passage is one which confirms that the wifely side of things has a present application, because she is led into Sarah’s tent. It is the present aspect of the marriage, connected with Sarah’s tent – a provisional position.

• In our dispensation the assembly fills out the place which Israel forfeited in rejecting its Messiah.

• In the eternal setting, the assembly is seen prepared as a bride adorned for her husband; and it does not say there that she has made herself ready.

• I think we have to take each scripture in its own setting; and the one we are now considering stands in its own beauty.

Ques. Does it not become a peculiar challenge to us, as to how much we are allied to this feature of making herself ready?

G.R.C. Proverbs 31 links with that; the testing is to bring out the righteousnesses of saints, is it not?

Rem. Yes. Mr. Darby gave a very short but powerful definition of the word “royalty”.

• He said it was effective power in action; and is that not bound up with making herself ready? Things are done, and they are done efficiently and effectively.

G.R.C. Very good. And that also bears on the armies, because, as to the wife, it says it was given to her that she should be clothed in fine linen, bright and pure;

• and then, with regard to the armies, in verse 14 it says,
  • “And the armies which are in the heaven followed him upon white horses, clad in white, pure, fine linen”.

• So that the wifely garments are quite suited for military service; we do not need to change our apparel.

Rem. Say a little more about that.

G.R.C. In the Song of Songs the spouse does not need to change her apparel; she is,

• “Terrible as troops with banners”, chapter 6: 4.

Rem. And when he describes her appreciatively in detail, in the Song of Songs, it is always in the beauty of her military array, showing what military prowess in the assembly means to the heart of Christ now.

G.R.C. He delights in a militant wife.

Rem. As David in Abigail.

G.R.C. And so this setting of the Lord is one which should engage our affections. It is a marvellous presentation!

• “I saw the heaven opened, and behold, a white horse”;

• that is, military operations are now in mind; and so the white horse is called attention to first, and the armies follow on white horses. Are we equal to riding on white horses?

Ques. Would this be the result of the exercise of overcoming?

G.R.C. It would. It is the exercise of overcoming which brings about the righteousnesses of the saints, and fits us for riding, in the coming day, upon white horses.

• But it should mark us in principle now. The Lord is upon a white horse – it says,
  • “One sitting on it, called Faithful and True, and he judges and makes war in righteousness. And his eyes are a flame of fire, and upon his head many diadems”.

• What a description that is! How it delights the lovers of Christ! No one else is spoken of in such a way –
  • “Upon his head many diadems, having a name written which no one knows but himself”.

• And so, while He is called “Faithful and True”, the first name which comes before us is a name written.

• It is written, so that we can see the writing, but it is to impress us that there is something there which is beyond us; there is a name written,
  • “which no one knows but himself”. And then it says,

  • “He is clothed with a garment dipped in blood, and his name is called …“;

• this would be, I suppose, the way He becomes known through experience –
  • “His name is called The Word of God. And the armies which are in the heaven followed him upon white horses, clad in white, pure, fine linen. And out of his mouth goes a sharp two-edged sword, that with it he might smite the nations”.

  • And then, in verse 16, it says, “And he has upon his garment, and upon his thigh, a name written” – this is another name written.

• “The Word of God” is a name by which He is called; but there are two names written, one of which no one knows but Himself, and the other,
  • “A name written, King of kings, and Lord of lords”.

• What a marvellous presentation this is of Christ! Every lover of Christ exults in this.

Rem. What power this would give in suffering here – the apprehension of the Lord in this way, as King of kings and Lord of lords!

G.R.C. What an honour to be the bondman of such a one!

Ques. One of the features which marked the great warrior Paul, in conflict, was pureness.

• Would that be purity of motive and association in keeping with Christ’s garments according to Mark’s gospel?

G.R.C. We would become casualties otherwise, but there is no thought of a casualty in this army.

Ques. Why is the name written on the thigh?

Ques. Is it the strength to support and go through, do you think?

Ques. In Daniel 4: 35 it says,

• “He doeth according to his will in the army of the heavens”.

• Does that refer back to bondmanship in those who have part in it?

G.R.C. It does. The centurion said, as to the army,

• “I say to this one, Go, and he goes; and to another, Come, and he comes”, Matthew 8: 9.

Ques. Referring to the cup and the Lord’s Supper, is it not significant that in 1 Corinthians 11 it is not recorded that the Lord’s blood is poured out for us?

G.R.C. I think that bears on what we have said about chapter 5 of this book. It is left open in Corinthians –

• “This cup is the new covenant in my blood”

• for us to have as wide a view of the glory of the great Redeemer as possible. It is, “My blood”, and all that it has laid the basis for.

But there is one more point in this passage which we ought to refer to.

• “Out of his mouth goes a sharp two-edged sword”.

• It is the only weapon the Lord uses apparently. And
  • “the sword of the Spirit, which is God’s word,”

• is the only weapon we need.

• Once the word of God in power is brought into the minds of men, the whole world-system will collapse;
  • and every difficulty among believers would collapse, if you could only bring the word of God in power into their minds.

• And so one great point in our conflict is that we should seek help to be more efficient in the use of the sword of the Spirit, because the conflict is in the minds of men. It is not with armies and navies!

• The real conflict is in the minds of men; and if you could get men on earth at the present time to be governed truly by the word of God, the conflict would be over.

Rem. In the end of verse 9 it says,

• “These are the true words of God”.

G.R.C. Quite so; then here,

• “His name is called The Word of God”.

• The Lord Jesus is the very expression of the mind of God; but then from His mouth there is the application of it, a sharp two-edged sword going forth, and that will bring down everything.

• The word of God in power will bring down every hostile force in this world, in the minds of men, and thus will settle everything. Once the minds of men are governed by the word of God, the conflict is over.

• That is where we need help at the present time, because Satan is always attacking to get something that is not God’s mind into the minds of the saints.

Rem. The only aggressive weapon in the armour in Ephesians is the sword, and it was the Lord’s only weapon in the temptation.

Ques. Does Paul have to do with both kinds of judgment in 2 Corinthians? He refers to,

• “the arms of our warfare”, chapter 10: 4.

• I wondered if that linked with judicial warfare.

• Then in chapter 13 he refers to coming the third time, and what will have to take place with those who have sinned and have not repented, involving what is sessional.

G.R.C. Those passages help. As you say, in 2 Corinthians 10 he is referring to the arms of their warfare;

• this would no doubt be judicial in character, for it is to overthrow strongholds in the minds of men.

• That is where the enemy’s strongholds are; and sometimes, alas, the enemy can get a stronghold in the mind of a believer. It says,
  • “overthrowing reasonings and every high thing that lifts itself up against the knowledge of God”.

• But then, as you say, in chapter 13 of that epistle he has sessional judgment in mind. He says,
  • “In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every matter be established. I have declared beforehand, and I say beforehand as present the second time, and now absent, to those that have sinned before, and to all the rest, that if I come again I will not spare”.

Ques. Sometimes we hear the expression, ‘The right thing was done in the wrong way’.

• Would this matter of judging and making war in righteousness show that everything, whether a matter of judgment or conflict, must be maintained in righteousness?

• We should do the right thing and in the right way.

G.R.C. That is very important.

• “He judges and makes war in righteousness”.

• Men say that anything is fair in war, but that is not so in divine warfare.

• If we do not know how to make war in righteousness, we shall lose the battle.

Ques. Would the apostle, speaking of,

• “the odour of his knowledge through us in every place”, 2 Corinthians 2: 14, confirm that?

• “An odour from death unto death, but to the others an odour from life unto life”.

• I was thinking of doing things in a right way, and thus of the odour which attached to Paul and those with him.

• They would do the right thing in the right way; so that, whether souls were saved, or whether souls were lost, there was an odour to God.

G.R.C. “A sweet odour of Christ to God in the saved and in those that perish”, 2 Corinthians 2: 15.

• So that, even in the preaching of the gospel would you not say there is a judicial aspect?

Rem. “Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord we persuade men”, 2 Corinthians 5: 11.

Ques. And should not the throne come more into the preaching in these last days?

• I was noticing, in the quotation the Lord makes in Luke 4, that in two cases the word “preach” is connected with the throne,

• and in one case it is connected with the needs of the poor. The Lord says, in reading,
  • “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has anointed me to preach” – that word is evangelize – “glad tidings to the poor”;

• that is, the needs of men are in mind. Then He goes on,
  • “to preach to captives deliverance”,

• and that word is the word connected with the throne.
  • And “to preach the acceptable year of the Lord”

• is also connected with the throne in Isaiah 61.

• And I wondered whether Paul, in his closing letter, the second epistle to Timothy, is not very emphatic in that matter. He says,
  • “Proclaim the word; be urgent in season and out of season”, 2 Timothy 4: 2,

• involving the maintenance of the rights of the throne amongst men.

G.R.C. And so in both of the epistles to Timothy he speaks of himself as a herald, does he not?

Rem. Yes. The word, “Proclaim” is the same word as herald, but as a verb.

G.R.C. That is interesting. A herald, one would judge, is connected with the throne. His message is a proclamation from the throne. And that is how Paul regarded himself,

• “a herald and apostle … a teacher of the nations”, 1 Timothy 2: 7, and 2 Timothy 1: 11.